tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3938330517236138280.post6454978498925052351..comments2023-11-05T07:23:49.530-05:00Comments on Vox clamanti: Is it Orthodox to be environmentally-conscious?V and Ehttp://www.blogger.com/profile/13065509512912860551noreply@blogger.comBlogger7125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3938330517236138280.post-63522095413594235152008-04-09T02:09:00.000-04:002008-04-09T02:09:00.000-04:00I think one's perspective on Creation itself is cr...I think one's perspective on Creation itself is critical to environmental concerns. Generally, I agree with your conclusions, although perhaps not how you got there. I have taken up the what I think is at issue on my own blog here;<BR/><BR/>http://whippleshire.blogspot.com/2008/04/curse-of-adam.html<BR/><BR/>I look forward to any response.<BR/><BR/>LesAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3938330517236138280.post-18731124586060368772008-04-08T09:32:00.000-04:002008-04-08T09:32:00.000-04:00How ironic.I was just writing a follow-up post add...How ironic.<BR/><BR/>I was just writing a follow-up post addressing the worship of Creation. This joker seems to be saving me the bother.<BR/><BR/>- V.V and Ehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13065509512912860551noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3938330517236138280.post-67799930574002842542008-04-08T09:05:00.000-04:002008-04-08T09:05:00.000-04:00Yes,You've drawn me out with your comment V!I coul...Yes,<BR/>You've drawn me out with your comment V!<BR/><BR/>I couldn't agree more that to denigrate creation constitutes a denial of the Incarnation. It's equally unfortunate, I think, when people go in the other direction and begin to worship creation. To wit, the below article which contains this gem of a quote from Paul Watson, an anti-sealing activist:<BR/> <BR/>"The Sea Shepherd Conservation Society recognizes that the deaths of four sealers is a tragedy but Sea Shepherd also recognizes that the slaughter of hundreds of thousands of seal pups is an even greater tragedy."<BR/><BR/>How's that for misanthropic weirdness? This same genius has described humanity as a disease and he proved too radical for the Sierra Club and Greenpeace (of which he is a founder).<BR/><BR/>I think these kinds of views are directly related to the fall in that they constitute a disordered relationship with creation. On the one hand some wish to profane creation by abusing it and attacking the image of God meant to appear there. On the other hand we have the Paul Watsons of the world who wish to worship creation over the creator and perpetuate the problem of the Fall. <BR/><BR/>Here's the article:<BR/>http://www.cbc.ca/canada/newfoundland-labrador/story/2008/04/04/stpierre-watson.htmlLifeSparkhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00139338306042721734noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3938330517236138280.post-60563961180962019542008-04-07T23:41:00.000-04:002008-04-07T23:41:00.000-04:00Elizabeth:Point taken. I should have said either ...Elizabeth:<BR/><BR/>Point taken. I should have said either that I was no student of theology or that I hadn't made the study of theology my hobby. <BR/><BR/>And we very much enjoy having you over here. I trust your job search is going well?<BR/><BR/>- V.V and Ehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13065509512912860551noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3938330517236138280.post-88227816742098789422008-04-07T20:25:00.000-04:002008-04-07T20:25:00.000-04:00of course the church only has three theologians......of course the church only has three theologians... St John, St. Gregory and St. Symenon the new <BR/><BR/>:) <BR/><BR/>just had to mention...<BR/><BR/>V -- i enjoy your earnestness and thoughtfulness. :)elizabethhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00962587884124992942noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3938330517236138280.post-5935316034311044682008-04-07T08:28:00.000-04:002008-04-07T08:28:00.000-04:00Stephen:Thanks for the quote from Bp. Kallistos (W...Stephen:<BR/><BR/>Thanks for the quote from Bp. Kallistos (Ware). I am no theologian, so it is always nice to have my assertions supported (or even echoed!) by those who are.<BR/><BR/>I think that you have intuited the heretical undergirdings for despising or neglecting God's Creation. It is profoundly Gnostic to despise the material things of this world, the dust from which we are made. Further, Gnosticism is a denial of the Incarnation of the Second Person of the Trinity, for it is in the Incarnation that we see God not only proclaiming the goodness of material form, but sanctifying it and hallowing it through the Person of Jesus Christ.<BR/><BR/>Which seems to leave me arguing that a failure to care for Creation is a denial of the Incarnation.<BR/><BR/>(I can't wait to hear what Vic will say.)<BR/><BR/>- V.V and Ehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13065509512912860551noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3938330517236138280.post-84324516278982096602008-04-07T00:03:00.000-04:002008-04-07T00:03:00.000-04:00Whenever I am confronted with environmental issues...Whenever I am confronted with environmental issues St. Seraphim always seems to come to mind - in fact, every time I go to step on a spider or to take out a fly I remember St. Seraphim and how dearly he cherished all life. <BR/><BR/>I am not all surprised to hear that Orthodox are environmentally conscious. <BR/><BR/>If the mysteries/sacraments take “material things and makes them a vehicle of the Spirit” (T. Ware) than I would expect that God could take any element and make it a vehicle of the Spirit...<BR/><BR/>Against the heresy of Gnosticism, Scripture teaches that the individual is saved (or condemned) in body and soul. In fact, Scripture says that the “human person is a unity of body and soul.” Rather than arbitrarily dividing the spiritual from the material, it is best to understand the two as parts of a whole. And this of course explains the place of material things in the mediation of grace...<BR/><BR/>And there is something mysterious (and special - understatement?) taking place as people gather to participate in the Eucharist for example... but I wouldn't think this would be confined to the Eucharist only - I would think that the whole of creation is a vehicle of the Spirit -and something therefore to be cherished and cared for and celebrated... if I understand Eastern Orthodoxy than I would think that Orthodox Christians - of all people - should be deeply concerned with the environment.<BR/><BR/>Am I right?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com